Second Councilwoman emerges in primary challenge against Schor

Lansing City Councilwoman Kathie Dunbar announced plans to run against Mayor Andy Schor on Sunday evening, just moments before former Mayor Virg Bernero bowed out of the race amid several recent allegations of sexual harassment published by City Pulse and MLive.

In an interview with City Pulse on Monday, she explained why she jumped into the race. 

City Pulse: When did you decide that you were going to run for mayor and what inspired you? 

Kathie Dunbar: I started seriously thinking about it one month ago. People were asking: How do we justify compromising our values in order to choose a mayor? The two viable options were going to either affect women negatively or affect Black and brown residents negatively, and folks really didn’t want to hold their nose and choose the least worst. I heard folks saying how they wanted a candidate that they could truly support, not one that was only the lesser of two evils.

CP: Bernero dropped out only a few moments after your announcement. Was it related?

KD: No. I was actually shocked — not shocked that he got out, but shocked by the timing. 

CP: What role did the last four years of the Schor administration play in making that decision?

KD: I have enjoyed a very positive relationship with Andy, and I had high hopes for him as mayor when he came in. I’ve found that although I’ve had access to him and have been able to talk to him about issues, he has refused to change and he’s defensive. I found that to be problematic on key issues — like the complaints about racism in his office and the steps that he was supposedly taking to address the culture. I also had a huge problem with him tear-gassing our residents during a protest and not being accountable for the decision that was made there. I still have problems with the lack of transparency surrounding the Hulon death in the jail. 

CP: Did Bernero’s candidacy inspire you to run too? Why not just rally behind Bernero? 

KD: The community wasn’t rallying behind Virg. And Virg has his own issues, as we’ve seen. The experiences of these women are disturbing and numerous. And I did not get the sense that he understood his role in this. I didn’t get the sense he understood the power dynamics. He kept insisting that this was about infidelity and that his wife had forgiven him. But that’s not what this was about. It was about a systemic problem, this pervasive thought process — particularly among older white men — that don’t get how problematic their behavior is, how degraded women feel when their value is wrapped up in objectification and not in their job performance.

CP: It’s no secret that you and Bernero have been political allies. He and his family have provided some fairly significant support to your political campaigns in the past. You two agreed on a host of issues. I don’t think anyone would’ve been too surprised to see you endorse him. Were the sexual harassment allegations the tipping point for you, or is there more to it?

KD: I’ll be clear. His leadership as mayor was strong and decisive. I agreed with his policies 95% of the time. We shared the same political, economic and social views. Outside of the allegations, I would say he was a good choice for mayor. Now knowing what has come forward and watching him flip from apologies to accusations to denials has changed my perspective.

CP: Given your close relationship over the years: Were you surprised to see these allegations?

KD: Yes. I am his contemporary. I do not fit what appears to be the profile of the women who are coming forward. I have never had this experience with him. And I don’t believe I was ever in the presence of him when these things were occurring. I have racked my brain about that. The whispers that I remember were of marital affairs. That was the worst kept secret in City Hall. 

For the remainder of this interview, please visit lansingcitypulse.com